No.27016[Reply]
According to Rowling one of the reasons Snape joined the Death Eaters was because he hoped it would impress Lily, so it looks like he believed that Lily was attracted to bullies. Rowling has also said that Lily already fancied James in the underpants scene, and later on she went on to date James despite the fact that he had threatened her with violence, stalked her for years (Rowling also says that James subjected Snape to "relentless bullying" out of sexual jealousy, so he thought he has a right to control her friendships long before they were dating) and tried to force her to go out with him against her will. Her sister married Vernon Dursley. So Snape's assumption that the Evans girls were turned on by bullies was perfectly reasonable and may well have been correct.
Even if it wasn't, as far as we are shown James had no redeeming personality traits at that age, other than loyalty to his friends and not being bigoted against half-humans (just, you know, poor working class people and Muggles). Either he had virtues we don't know about, or Lily took up with him out of a combination of proximity (they were Head Boy and Head Girl so would have had to work together) and the fact that he was a rich handsome sports jock. I don't believe the claim that he deflated his head for her - the prequelette JK wrote for charity shows him just before the start of 7th year, indulging in a little light Muggle-baiting, and after he and Lily were married Pottermore says he split up her family because Vernon was proud of his new car, so James couldn't resist humiliating the Muggles by making a huge production out of how much richer than them he was. Pottermore says that one of the main reasons the Dursleys resented Harry was because James had been so awful to them.
James did eventually turn out to be brave, loyal to his family and a good dad - but those were all things Lily found out *after* she started dating him, so they can't have been reasons why she did so.
19 posts and 1 image reply omitted. Click reply to view. No.27092
“I’m sorry.”
“I’m not interested.”
“I’m sorry!”
“Save your breath”
It was nighttime. Lily, who was wearing a dressing gown, stood with her arms folded in front of the portrait of the Fat Lady, at the entrance to Gryffindor Tower.
“I only came out because Mary told me you were threatening to sleep here.”
“I was. I would have done. I never meant to call you Mudblood, it just – ”
“Slipped out?” There was no pity in Lily’s voice. “It’s too late. I’ve made excuses for you for years. None of my friends can understand why I even talk to you. You and your precious little Death Eater friends – you see, you don’t even deny it! You don’t even deny that’s what you’re all aiming to be! You can’t wait to join You-Know-Who, can you?”
Post too long. Click here to view the full text. No.27093
>“Lily, whose furious expression had twitched for an instant, as though she was going to smile, said ‘Let him down!’”
Holy fuck, I can't believe she wrote that.
No.27102
I will NEVER understand why people think Snape is a good dude or that him being in love with Lily so long after her death is sooooo romantic. Snape is the epitome of the ‘nice’ guy. He is the type of dude who complains about being ‘friend zoned’. We see one afternoon from Snape’s POV and suddenly James is the bully? Snape was basically the dude who stays your friend because he’s convinced one day you’re going to wake up and realize he’s perfect for you and he goes around lowering your self esteem and harassing your love interests in hopes they’ll go away. Every time I read Harry Potter I am just so disgusted by Snape and what a slimly manipulative little worm he is.
No.27111
I think she twitches because she finds it funny, but she suppresses her amusement out of guilt. Whether that's guilt because she's a prefect and she's supposed to be putting a stop to that sort of behaviour, or guilt because she knows that she should put Snape before James…who knows?
Personally, I think they'd long drifted at this point. I suspect Harry's statement to the teachers in HBP is telling - he says that Snape hated his mother, and none of them correct him or mention that they were once friends.
It seems logical that for a Gryffindor/Slytherin friendship, the two kept it very quiet - so it was easy for Lily to drift away whilst Snape harboured the delusion that they were best friends forever and nothing would ever change. Lily probably only kept meeting him because it was easier than dealing with the emotional fallout of dropping him entirely.
You only have to look at how quickly she turns on him and cuts him out of her life to see that Lily has been waiting for an opportunity to wash her hands of Snape.
Lily had also softened towards James in a big way. She doesn't want to listen to the story of her best friend's near death experience; she already believes the version she's heard in Gryffindor tower that paints James as a hero.
She's sexually attracted to James, despite her protests that he's an arrogant toe-rag. In contrast, Snape has long since served his purpose. He was the knowledge holder when it came to Hogwarts, but now there's no mystery - she's as much a part of the wizarding world as he is, and there are plenty of other kids (less awkward kids) for her to socialise with. Snape had been convenient.
She no longer needed him, and he appeared obsessed with keeping her away from James. If she cut Snape out of the picture, she no longer has to feel guilty about her growing feelings for James. If they'd remained friends, it's unlikely that Snape would've accepted her dating James.
No.27112
They are books for Children, nerds.
No.27113
Snape is an excellent and fascinating character for deconstruction. I believe he was motivated primarily by vengeance, though he himself was likely not sure exactly what drove him. Almost every action he takes is intended to forward the death of Voldemort for killing Lily.
On the other hand, he definitely did not truly love Lily. If you love somebody, you don't join a neo-nazi cult dedicated to the extinction of their race. Snape was certainly infatuated with her, obsessed even, but he didn't love her. I can't think of a single example of Snape doing something he didn't want to do solely because Lily asked it of him. He didn't stop associating with pureblood supremacists, he didn't stop being a dickhead to her friends, he didn't stop researching dark magic. He was perfectly comfortable with letting her husband and child die, so long as she was preserved. That's not love. That's just sickening. If Snape were a muggle, he'd hang out on /pol/ with a fedora and trenchcoat talking about the bitch that friendzoned him.
After her death of course, Snape totally aligns himself with Dumbledore, because Voldemort killed the object of his obsession. However, that does not change Snape's own morality. He's very much a bad person, he didn't leave the Death Eaters because he disagreed with their politics, he left for personal reasons. Even when other Death Eaters feigned being reformed, upstanding members of society, Snape continued to be a savage dickhead who openly abused children for a decade, safe in the knowledge that Dumbledore wanted him close at hand. Essentially taking out his everest-sized pile of salt out on victims who can't fight back. In this aspect, he's an irredeemable piece of shit.
Over the years, he likely became more sympathetic to the Order's cause, hanging out with a dude as charismatic as Dumbledore for ten years will do that to a man. Even if he was a bullying piece of shit, he's not straight up evil like most Death Eaters, so naturally he is concerned for the safety of an eleven year old girl, even if he dislikes her or her family.
In regards to Harry specifically, Snape hated the boy. That much is transparent. He protected him because the prophecy states Harry must be the one to defeat Voldemort. Snape may have self-justified by saying he was protecting Lily's son, but if that were truly the case, he wouldn't have been such an unrepentant cunt to an innocent eleven year old.
No.27153
This shit really bothers me I keep thinking about it I feel like I'm Snape