/what/ - ...

>It seems clear from the way Lily speaks to Severus - "None of my friends can understand why I even talk to you" - "my friends", not "my other friends" - that Lily had already rejected him in her heart months if not years before, and was just looking for an excuse to get shot of him. And when she rejects him, and when she goes out with the bully who tormented him and still torments him, he still isn't angry with her. According to JKR, one of the main reasons he joined the Death Eaters was because he thought it might impress Lily.

jesus cheist this hurts to read, snape was the ulimate cuck. i hope im not like him

the entire series wasn't actually about harry, but rather how a beta went to hogwarts long ago, where he developed oneitis for a girl named lily and beta orbited her while she married the chad who bullies him. later she squeezes out chad's son out before they get killed by literally hitler. as it turns out, snape's oneitis was so bad that he couldn't de-orbit himself even when his planet ceased to exist, so he ends up dedicating his life to protecting his oneitis and chad's spawn while simultaneously resenting himself and the boy for it.

Snape is worse than a cuckold, he's a beta orbiter, he's a fucking loser in love with a woman that smiled at him once and somehow caused him to have delusions that there was more to it than that.

And Harry named his kid for this fucker? Stupid Rowling.

Snape was a passive aggressive beta orbiter and it's fucked up that harry suddenly loves him and names his kid after him at the end and paints his dad as the jock bully.

He 'defends' harry for altruistic 'oh woe is me I sacrificed everything for lily' BS reasons but treats him like shit because he's still emotionally a bitter child.

Nah. He was just a chill guy who was popular because he was good looking, friendly and good at sports. The only bitter dick head was snape who talked shit because he was insecure then started thinking about murdering them with forbidden spells because they basically just kicked his ass for being a little shit.

Snape was a creepy loser back when he was a kid and when he grew up he took out all his frustrations he had with Harry's dad on him BUT OH HOW TRAGIC HE SAW HARRY'S MUM IN HIS EYES.

I hate people that try to prop him up as a hero, everything he did was for his own selfish reasons to "avenge" Lily Potter, he didn't give a shit about the order of the phoenix or harry or dumbledore, just getting back at Voldemort.

He's a pathetic piece of shit, and harry giving his kid Severus for a middle name was baloney.

Snape is the ultimate female power fantasy: This guy who is utterly devoted to a woman that he'll endure years of unrequited love and still love her all the same. But yeah Rowling really did fuck up with making him a sympathetic character, in fact a lot of the time even as a kid I felt outright disgust towards both him and Lily; him for being such a pathetic beta and her for being so blind.

I mean on the one hand he loved this girl since he was a kid and never once let her know of his feelings for her until it was far too late and so he dug his own grave, but on the other it says something about how self absorbed and heartless a person Rowling unintentionally wrote Lily as that not only did she date a guy who relentlessly bullied one of her friends since childhood but also in that she never once questioned whether Snape had romantic feelings for her, despite all evidence pointing towards it for years. Instead she elected to just assume it was because she was just that great or whatever. Like I said, ultimate female power fantasy.

he's a perpetual cuck and only a woman could have written a protagonist las pathetic as snape, not realizing she had him live a miserable unfulfilling life and still present it like he served some honorable purpose.

the love of his life, his soul mate, cucked him for a literal chad/jock that bullied him. the guy who made her best friend's life miserable, she opened her twat for his cum rather than sticking by snape who loved her unconditionally. a betrayal that made him bitter for the rest of his lonely life.

then the dumb bitch and her husband got themselves blown up, and snapes entire life was, for some odd reason, dedicated to protecting the fruit of his cucking. the living breathing reminder that life isn't fair.

he gets brutally murdered and his dying breath is used noticing the son of his rival has the same eyes as the woman he loved. one last salt in the wound.

again, only a woman could've wrote a male character this pathetic and be totally oblivious to it. snape should have just joined voldemort and been his right hand man. at least there would be some dignity in that.

he wasn't cucked by definition but lily was his best friend. now i'm not a chick, but if some dude bullied my best friend, i should stand up for him or at least hate the bully with my friend, not start blowing the guy in the room of requirement. she betrayed poor snape. she didn't have to pick him to marry or date, but did she HAVE to pick the dude who made his life shit? snape was bitter his whole life over that shit and you can tell with his attitude towards harry, and how his memory of getting bullied had him visibly shook when harry saw it.

on top of all that, his whole purpose, reluctantly or not, was basically protecting harry.

>Fall in love with girl
>Never admit feelings to her
>She falls in love with the Chad who bullies you
>Eventually his Chad ways get them both killed
>Love her so much you devote your life to looking after their kid who looks like the Chad who fucked your one true love since childhood
Why was Snap such a fucking beta? I mean give the poor guy some self respect for fuck's sake.

>>27050
Is this guy just copypasting shit from somewhere?

>>27051
Obviously.

>>27052
Why?

>Bullied
>fapped alone while his oneitis was being fucked by the Chad
>his beta cuckness made him bitter his whole life
>died a virgin

Is Snape /ourguy/?

https://archive.4plebs.org/tv/thread/97289580/

wwtd?

she probably imagined james' good qualities were apparant to lily at the time but never remembered to actually depict how because she was more focused on the characters tension. she certainly wouldnt say that he did not appear to have any redeeming qualities at the time if you asked her, and would probably vaugely retcon in that it was apparant in other ways, she just failed to write about it. theres no sense in analyzing the canon, like that.
of course, that is the automatic intellectual rationalization in response to it being pointed out that when you just look at what actually happens for what it is, it seems to conflict with yours and presumeably the authors values.
the real reason for making him a bold chad jock is cultural, psychological, emotional. it must have just seemed right to her that a girl would want a mean, socially dominant bully who is cruel and demeaning to people socially 'lesser' than him and bullies other people to secure the object of his sexual desire.
because, of course, societies gender norms, which affect someones underlying assumptions about themself and what they're here for, prescribe that a better girl is one who is soft, passive, and receiving of a hard and dominant force. therfore, since girls like veryone else are exposed to behavior exhibiting these norms to a greater or lesser extent from birth, they naturally internalize these ideas. those ideas in some form or another, and things compatible with them, become their idea of normal, their sense of self and who they are, shape their preferences. its not a set of chains holding them to these ideas, humans as social animals embrace and adapt themselves to their social 'place', when that sense is inculcated from early life it really does mold what they personally feel like they want, and how they feel baout things. they go on to perpetuate them themselves.
and, of course, on the other side, mens prescribed role is sexual "conquest", to dominate and coerce other people, to be bold, loud and confident, etc etc. there are other, less awful norms about masculinity too, but these bad ones really are there, and are very important ones. most people arent really like this naturally, but men adapt themselves to fit into them, they want to be them, so that they dont have to be failures, pathetic worthless less-than-garbage failures of people like those who dont live up to cultural ideals about whta they're supposed to be.
so naturally, the unconcious, emotional feeling about characters romance is that the female character would adore and love the ideal man. but, the author doesnt conciously admire these sorts of qualities, in her concious values they're at least a little bad, so they're either reframed or portrayed as flaws of a character who is otherwise good in ways they conciously value.
of course, in real life men who can live up to those worst expectations of maleness- coercion, cruelty, arrogance, 'conquest'- are not nice people. if they have some good inside them, its smothered and trapped by their need to not be failures as men. they're prone to depression and fits of anger, in part from the dissonance of being an innately caring, social animal but forcing themselves to be a stoic, cold golem, or else face ostracism. this often manifests as abuse of their partners. some of them were just always psychopaths.
feminists point out little bits and pieces of these things, and pay lip service to how changing it would 'help men', but most never really internalize or appreciate the implications of it. its just something they say to get one over people who dont identify with their social label. they refuse to acknowledge how they participate in producing and reproducing these toxic norms just as much as any man. chad IS toxic masculinity, the loser is characterised by his failure to be chad, and only exhibits that toxicity insofar as he tries in vain to live up to it because hes always been told hes worthless and disgusting if he doesnt. but, they do backflips to avoid this, because chad is hot and the want to fuck him, because they're just as affected by this as everyone else. its not inflicted upon them by some "other side", they participate in it like everyone else.
any remedy to socities social ills and specifically the social ones in relation to gender will have to not shy away from what the 'literature' of feminism says, the theory from which the vulgar, stupid rank and file adherent bastardizes their ideas. to embrace what is gotten right by people who call themselves feminists, but more fully explore it and flesh out its im plications, without the myopic, tribalistic, us-vs-them mentality, or any of the loyalty to a label or a movement that prevents not-stupid feminists from criticizing said mentality, clouding the waters. and it will have to do the very same with the ideas and criticisms of mens advocates. discard the mysoginy and the misanthropy, the myopia, for a happier tomorrow.
I never read harry potter btw.

Having recently re-read "The Prince's Tale", it makes me realize how generally luke-warm Lily is towards Snape. Her actions later in life make PERFECT sense, actually. But for her to be Snape's happiest moment in life… it's so pathetic it's sad.

And next, Snape was kneeling in Sirius' old bedroom. Tears were dripping from the end of his hooked nose as he read the old letter from Lily. The second page carried only a few words:

could ever have been friends with Gellert Grindelwald. I think her mind's going, personally!

Lots of Love,

Lily

Snape took the page bearing Lily's signature, and her love, ans tucked it insider his robes. Then he ripped in two the photograph he was also holding, so that he kept the part from which Lily laughed, throwing the portion showing James and harry back onto the floor, under the chest of drawers…

This scene makes me tear up every time. Imagining him just… scavenging from things Lily gave to other people really hurts me. Snape's done a lot of bad in his life and should probably be punished for it, but there is just something fundamentally lonely about Snape's relationship with Lily. Chances are, Snape has done too many horrible things to end up where Lily is and him keeping her "love" close almost makes it seem like he knows he's heading to the gallows and wants to keep her near. Harry does the same thing before facing Voldemort, but his loved ones are actually there. Snape gets an old letter and half a picture to give him strength as he goes into the final Act.

I certainly don't hate him, he's definitely one of the most interesting and complex characters in the series, but… His whole obsession with Lily completely creeps me out.

Up to a point, I could feel kinda sympathetic about the whole unrequited love thing, but then it just went too far. After their falling out, Lily makes it clear that she wants nothing to do with him and that their relationship is not salvageable. But then he keeps obsessing over her and it starts giving me creep-stalker-y vibes. He's really a very pathetic character in the sense that he remains in love with a woman who wants nothing to do with him for over 20 years, and I find it very difficult to not feel disdain for the immaturity/superficiality of his love (given that I have personal experience as the recipient of stalkerish obsession).

It's an interesting combination of emotions I feel for Snape. I don't like him, but I don't think he was an awful person. I think he's pathetic, but at the same time brave, and I can simultaneously sympathize with him and think he's creepy (I still mostly think he's creepy, though). Definitely a testament to Rowling's ability in creating the character.

>>27053
fuck off

“I’m sorry.”

“I’m not interested.”

“I’m sorry!”

“Save your breath”

It was nighttime. Lily, who was wearing a dressing gown, stood with her arms folded in front of the portrait of the Fat Lady, at the entrance to Gryffindor Tower.

“I only came out because Mary told me you were threatening to sleep here.”

“I was. I would have done. I never meant to call you Mudblood, it just – ”

“Slipped out?” There was no pity in Lily’s voice. “It’s too late. I’ve made excuses for you for years. None of my friends can understand why I even talk to you. You and your precious little Death Eater friends – you see, you don’t even deny it! You don’t even deny that’s what you’re all aiming to be! You can’t wait to join You-Know-Who, can you?”

He opened his mouth, but closed it without speaking.

“I can’t pretend anymore. You’ve chosen your way, I’ve chosen mine.”

“No – listen, I didn’t mean – ”

“ – to call me Mudblood? But you call everyone of my birth Mudblood, Severus. Why should I be any different?”

He struggled on the verge of speech, but with a contemptuous look she turned and climbed back through the portrait hole…

>“Lily, whose furious expression had twitched for an instant, as though she was going to smile, said ‘Let him down!’”


Holy fuck, I can't believe she wrote that.

I will NEVER understand why people think Snape is a good dude or that him being in love with Lily so long after her death is sooooo romantic. Snape is the epitome of the ‘nice’ guy. He is the type of dude who complains about being ‘friend zoned’. We see one afternoon from Snape’s POV and suddenly James is the bully? Snape was basically the dude who stays your friend because he’s convinced one day you’re going to wake up and realize he’s perfect for you and he goes around lowering your self esteem and harassing your love interests in hopes they’ll go away. Every time I read Harry Potter I am just so disgusted by Snape and what a slimly manipulative little worm he is.

I think she twitches because she finds it funny, but she suppresses her amusement out of guilt. Whether that's guilt because she's a prefect and she's supposed to be putting a stop to that sort of behaviour, or guilt because she knows that she should put Snape before James…who knows?

Personally, I think they'd long drifted at this point. I suspect Harry's statement to the teachers in HBP is telling - he says that Snape hated his mother, and none of them correct him or mention that they were once friends.

It seems logical that for a Gryffindor/Slytherin friendship, the two kept it very quiet - so it was easy for Lily to drift away whilst Snape harboured the delusion that they were best friends forever and nothing would ever change. Lily probably only kept meeting him because it was easier than dealing with the emotional fallout of dropping him entirely.

You only have to look at how quickly she turns on him and cuts him out of her life to see that Lily has been waiting for an opportunity to wash her hands of Snape.

Lily had also softened towards James in a big way. She doesn't want to listen to the story of her best friend's near death experience; she already believes the version she's heard in Gryffindor tower that paints James as a hero.

She's sexually attracted to James, despite her protests that he's an arrogant toe-rag. In contrast, Snape has long since served his purpose. He was the knowledge holder when it came to Hogwarts, but now there's no mystery - she's as much a part of the wizarding world as he is, and there are plenty of other kids (less awkward kids) for her to socialise with. Snape had been convenient.

She no longer needed him, and he appeared obsessed with keeping her away from James. If she cut Snape out of the picture, she no longer has to feel guilty about her growing feelings for James. If they'd remained friends, it's unlikely that Snape would've accepted her dating James.

They are books for Children, nerds.

Snape is an excellent and fascinating character for deconstruction. I believe he was motivated primarily by vengeance, though he himself was likely not sure exactly what drove him. Almost every action he takes is intended to forward the death of Voldemort for killing Lily.

On the other hand, he definitely did not truly love Lily. If you love somebody, you don't join a neo-nazi cult dedicated to the extinction of their race. Snape was certainly infatuated with her, obsessed even, but he didn't love her. I can't think of a single example of Snape doing something he didn't want to do solely because Lily asked it of him. He didn't stop associating with pureblood supremacists, he didn't stop being a dickhead to her friends, he didn't stop researching dark magic. He was perfectly comfortable with letting her husband and child die, so long as she was preserved. That's not love. That's just sickening. If Snape were a muggle, he'd hang out on /pol/ with a fedora and trenchcoat talking about the bitch that friendzoned him.

After her death of course, Snape totally aligns himself with Dumbledore, because Voldemort killed the object of his obsession. However, that does not change Snape's own morality. He's very much a bad person, he didn't leave the Death Eaters because he disagreed with their politics, he left for personal reasons. Even when other Death Eaters feigned being reformed, upstanding members of society, Snape continued to be a savage dickhead who openly abused children for a decade, safe in the knowledge that Dumbledore wanted him close at hand. Essentially taking out his everest-sized pile of salt out on victims who can't fight back. In this aspect, he's an irredeemable piece of shit.

Over the years, he likely became more sympathetic to the Order's cause, hanging out with a dude as charismatic as Dumbledore for ten years will do that to a man. Even if he was a bullying piece of shit, he's not straight up evil like most Death Eaters, so naturally he is concerned for the safety of an eleven year old girl, even if he dislikes her or her family.

In regards to Harry specifically, Snape hated the boy. That much is transparent. He protected him because the prophecy states Harry must be the one to defeat Voldemort. Snape may have self-justified by saying he was protecting Lily's son, but if that were truly the case, he wouldn't have been such an unrepentant cunt to an innocent eleven year old.

This shit really bothers me I keep thinking about it I feel like I'm Snape